{"id":43279,"date":"2016-03-01T17:23:29","date_gmt":"2016-03-01T22:23:29","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.smbtraining.com\/blog\/?p=43279"},"modified":"2023-05-09T17:01:29","modified_gmt":"2023-05-09T21:01:29","slug":"a-conversation-on-an-insufficient-stop-loss-in-valeant","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.smbtraining.com\/blog\/a-conversation-on-an-insufficient-stop-loss-in-valeant","title":{"rendered":"A conversation on an insufficient stop loss in Valeant"},"content":{"rendered":"<figure class=\"tmblr-full\" data-orig-height=\"230\" data-orig-width=\"587\"><img decoding=\"async\" src=\"https:\/\/56.media.tumblr.com\/21a6f059239c5a0d33a9db8e5d9a1563\/tumblr_inline_o3dspwlGvM1slheli_540.jpg\" alt=\"image\" data-orig-height=\"230\" data-orig-width=\"587\" \/><\/figure>\n<p>During a group meeting with our newest traders we discussed a Double Bottom in Valeant (stock symbol VRX), that triggered a buy from a new trader on our desk.<\/p>\n<figure class=\"tmblr-full\" data-orig-height=\"787\" data-orig-width=\"963\"><img decoding=\"async\" src=\"https:\/\/41.media.tumblr.com\/d9676db338c66aa693f4cd4e643065bc\/tumblr_inline_o3dr92nXmv1slheli_540.png\" alt=\"image\" data-orig-height=\"787\" data-orig-width=\"963\" \/><\/figure>\n<p>Newb: I saw VRX holding near 62, so I got long.<\/p>\n<p>Me: Where was your stop?<\/p>\n<p>Newb: 61.90<\/p>\n<p>Me: So you got stopped out?<\/p>\n<p>Newb: No<\/p>\n<p>Ok so now we have a trading issue.\u00a0 VRX touched below 61,90 so the trader should have gotten stopped out if he was honoring his stop.<\/p>\n<p>Me: It touched below 61.90, how did you not get stopped out?<\/p>\n<p>Newb: Well it did not trade below there for long.<\/p>\n<p>Me: So your stop was price AND time?\u00a0 How much time did you want it to hold below 61.90 for your stop to trigger?<\/p>\n<p>Newb: Maybe a minute?<\/p>\n<p>Me: What would have done if the stock went from 62 to 55?\u00a0 Because that will happen at a few times a year.\u00a0 It only takes one crazy move to end your trading career.<\/p>\n<p>The trader thought and replied&#8230;.<\/p>\n<p>Newb: I would have hit it out below 61.74.<\/p>\n<p>Me: I thought you said your stop was 61.90?<\/p>\n<p>The trader did not have a clear enough stop loss plan for this trade.\u00a0 And you could tell from his explanation that he was undervaluing how important it was to play defense with his trading.\u00a0 He was very confident the trade would work.\u00a0 And it did by the way.\u00a0 And this is a worthwhile trading setup to study for your trading.\u00a0 But what if it didn\u2019t?<\/p>\n<p>During lunch I was discussing how training was going with a different new trader.\u00a0 He remarked how he was eliminating some bad habits, like not keeping definitive stops.\u00a0 Oh like his training classmate above.\u00a0 Very interesting.<\/p>\n<p>So two, very bright, very interested in markets, new traders, during the same day display their struggle with keeping definitive stops.<\/p>\n<p>Sustaining and consistently profitable traders declare definitive stops before they enter their positions.\u00a0 As you gain experience those stops will become more nuanced.\u00a0 A new trader might set a stop of 61.90.\u00a0 An experienced trader might set a stop of 5 minutes holding below 61.74 OR below 61.49 OR if the stock does not bounce from the 62 level in 15 minutes.<\/p>\n<p>Being unclear about your exact stop loss will cause you to miss necessary exits and take larger than necessary losses in these fast moving markets. Once that new trader had to think what he would have done if VRX dropped sharply below 61.90, his stop plan was not sufficient.<\/p>\n<p>Be definitive.\u00a0 Be crystal clear.\u00a0 Determine stops prior to entry.\u00a0 Honor them.<\/p>\n<p>And then review your stop strategy.<\/p>\n<p><b>Related Posts<\/b><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.smbtraining.com\/blog\/what-is-the-advantage-of-using-a-manual-stop-vs-a-hard-stop\">A manual stop v a hard stop<\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.smbtraining.com\/blog\/learn-to-take-a-loss\">Learn to take a loss<\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.smbtraining.com\/blog\/a-trade-to-increase-your-stop-loss\">A trade to increase your stop loss<\/a><\/p>\n<p>* no relevant positions<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/tradingworkshop.com\/\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"aligncenter size-full wp-image-42831\" src=\"https:\/\/www.smbtraining.com\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2023\/03\/smbwebinarsignup.jpg\" alt=\"tradingworkshop\" width=\"600\" height=\"300\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>During a group meeting with our newest traders we discussed a Double Bottom in Valeant (stock symbol VRX), that triggered a buy from a new trader on our desk. Newb: I saw VRX holding near 62, so I got long. Me: Where was your stop? Newb: 61.90 Me: So you got stopped out? Newb: No Ok so now we have &#8230; <a href=\"https:\/\/www.smbtraining.com\/blog\/a-conversation-on-an-insufficient-stop-loss-in-valeant\" class=\"more-link\">Read More<\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":144,"featured_media":43280,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[1],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-43279","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-general-comments-2"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v26.1.1 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/wordpress\/plugins\/seo\/ -->\n<title>A Conversation on an Insufficient Stop Loss in Valeant | SMB Training<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"Learn from SMB&#039;s analysis of a failed stop loss in Valeant Pharmaceuticals and discover how to avoid similar trading mistakes.\" \/>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, 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